A few weeks ago, I was called by a consultant who was prospecting for business. He was a friend of a friend, so I felt duty-bound to give him thirty minutes to tell me about his company and the service he provides. Sadly, it was a complete waste of time.
For starters, the guy talked non-stop. I probably didn’t say more than three sentences in the entire call. Worse, he made all kinds of assumptions about me and about my company. Most of them were wrong. I gently tried to correct him, but he didn’t seem too interested in my point-of-view. Evidently, he had his script. He was determined to get through it.
It made me wonder how many times I do the same thing with others.
The people I value the most are those who know how to listen. I actively seek them out. Interestingly, these are also the people who have the most influence with me. Why? Because I feel like they understand me.
Early in my business career, one of my mentors told me that conversations should be like a game of ping pong. You wait for the ball to come over the net, then you hit it back to the person on the other side. Then you do it all over again—and on it goes. In a good conversation, there is both give and take. This is something we have intentionally tried to pass on to our own children.
I certainly much left to learn, but over the years, here are some of the things I have observed about “conversational ping pong”:
- Listen with your heart. Words are a small part of any communication. The intellectual exchange is only part of the exercise. You can pick up a lot by paying attention to the non-verbal cues, including the other person’s eyes, their tone of voice, and their body language.
- Be aware of how much you are talking. I try to talk in sound bites. Frankly, I learned this from doing hundreds of radio and TV interviews through the years. If I didn’t periodically stop talking and give the interviewers a chance to speak, they weren’t bashful about interrupting me or bringing the interview to a close. People are more polite, but you can still lose them, as the would-be consultant did with me.
- Hit the ball back over the net. Nothing communicates value and respect to a person more than asking them what they think. Unless you’re giving a formal speech, every encounter should be a dialogue. That means you have to consciously hit the ball back over the net and give the other person a chance to respond. The best way to do this is with thoughtful questions.
- Ask follow-up questions. The best listeners I know never stop with just one question. Like peeling an onion, they ask follow-up questions, going deeper each time. This is where you learn the most and where you tap into the possibility to add real value to the other person’s life. One question I like to ask is this, “How did it make you feel when that happened?”
- Provide positive feedback. A “poker-face” may help when you are playing cards, but it does not help build trust or develop relationships. People need to know that you are listening and understand them. Nodding your head and providing verbal affirmation are critical skills that anyone can learn, but they must be cultivated.
Your ability to lead is directly tied to your ability to lead powerful conversations. If you want to increase your influence, you have to perfect the gentle art of conversational ping pong.
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So true. There is a listen/reply ration that too many of us seem to ignore at times. I think that word “dialogue” that you used sums it up well. Problem is, too many step into a “conversation” with an agenda that often blinds them from effective communication. They really don't care about the other party, they just want to accomplish their goal… which rarely happens when approached in that way. Dialogue is two way. It’s discovery also (if used properly).
Good points. I find that too often I am thinking about the next point I want to make rather than seeking to understand the point the other person is making. I have to constantly work on this!
U shouldve hit his mouth with a pingpong racket so he’d stop. Er, is that what u call it– a racket? Whatever.. Or let him swallowed a pingpong ball. I’m just joking.
That definitely would have gotten the point across! ;-)
In ping-pong, it's called a paddle. :)
Great reminder. Communication is both art and science, as well as a life long journey. It is a skill so valuable that we should always be honing and polishing how we communicate. The visual of ping pong is perfect as a reminder for all of us to be aware of how we engage in communication and building relationships.
As for what I've learned, stoping to take the time to truly engage in two way communication with someone leads to rich, life long relationships.
Agreed. The older I get the less patience I have for people who like to hear themselves talk.
Great read Mike. I concur with all of your points raised here about being a better conversationalist. After each paragraph I kept saying “yes” inside in agreement to what you were saying.
I wrote an article on “7 tips to becoming a great conversationalist” (http://bit.ly/lkx4Y) and in your post you touched on nearly all the points I mentioned. Good to know that there are like-minded individuals out there like yourself. Again, I really appreciated your article, thanks!
Great. I will look forward to reading your post. Thanks for the link.
I definitely see how valuable this is just in everyday life. Especially within my work environment. I continually work on listening well to what others are saying around me.
Good article. I agree. I have learned that listening is the key. With your kind permission, I am posting a link to this in my sidebar on my blog.
Absolutely. I would be honored. Thanks.
I'm a listener. It's not a skill I've developed, it's just in my nature to listen. Back in college, a friend told me "I wish I could be a good listener like you." My immediate and pathetic response was "just stop talking."
Much older now, I see that those who are not good listeners are this way not because they can't stop talking, it's because they can't stop thinking about what they want to say.
When I think on your experience with that person, I think they failed because they didn't stop to hear your story.
Let's say they were trying to sell you on office coffee makers. They could spend 30 minutes trying to sell you on the wonderful benefits and features of their product. However, they would be much better to briefly explain their product and then ask you about your past experiences (good and bad) with office coffee makers. You might reveal something they never would have otherwise addressed had you not brought up the point. A salesman is trying to give a solution to a problem. If you don't think you have a problem, you aren't going to buy their product or service.
I will be honest about a pitfall of listening for me; it makes me want to provide a solution to whatever problem is introduced….by my wife. One day, she finally told me "I don't need you to solve my problem, I just need you to listen."
Your just-stop-talking comment cracked me up. I have five daughters. At various times, they have come to me for advice. Silly me: I thought they wanted me to say something! Not so much. They just wanted me to stop talking and listen.
I remember one time after listening to one of my daughters talk non-stop for an hour, she got up, hugged me, and said, "You are the best dad ever. Thanks so much for listening to me!"
Listening is one of the best gifts you can ever give.
I'll tuck this nugget away for later as my 9 and 6 year old girls grow up! :)
Ever since I've been blogging, I've become more of a talker than a listener. It's something I need to work on and this is a great reminder/lesson.
I also have found that my concentration span has reduced severely. People just don't talk in 140 characters or less!
Interesting. I think bogging has actually made me a better listener. Twitter, too. I realize now more than ever that it's all about the dialogue.
Of course, I could be completely self-deceived. ;-)
"I cold be completely self-deceived" made me laugh so hard I was glad I wasn't drinking something at the time or I would have spurted it out all over my laptop.
The difference between your experience and mine probably comes from the fact that I'm self-employed, sitting at home with little vocal interaction. I'm either conversing on twitter in short-fire bursts or writing monologues on my blog or through email.
I'm turning into a bit of a troll, methinks.
Just how does one "peel an opinion"? (This made me laugh, and then realize there's some deeper truth in this typo)….
How did I miss that one?
That's hilarious!
That cracked me up, too. I am the WORST when it comes to proofing my own work.
I also discovered that I had failed to convert my paragraphs into a list. Fixed that as well.
Thanks!
Maybe there's another blog in that! I know there's some kind of science to how our brains read the words as we intended them to be written, and not as they actually are – which is how we can read something five times and still overlook a typo.
Do we assume our intention comes across in conversation as well? Hmmm……. :-)
As part of listening, summarizing back to the speaker at appropriate intervals is critical – it allows course correction if you may have misunderstood, the briefer repetition further embosses the key points into your memory and thinking, and the speaker learns that you care and listen well.
On the talking side, I have become a fan of the practice of
"Aut tace aut loquere meliora silencio". It means,
Speak "only when the words outperform silence"!
This is great advice, Randy!
I've worked hard to not be half listening while I'm formulating my response. Far better would be to fully listen, validate the person's words and the person with this kind of repetition, and THEN respond.
Another great post, Mike.
Thanks Michael! I get it now!
I need to work with my 'Poker Face' :|
One of the best pieces of interview advice I've received during this economic downturn is "Don't be thinking about the answer to the question until they're done asking it."
When I'm conversing with someone, I have this detrimentally unfortunate tendency to hover over the metaphorical Family Feud buzzer, "efficiently" interrupting them with the right response as soon as I think I get it, so that they don't have to waste their time with excess words. I smugly feel like I'm doing someone a favor!
It is very hard for me, extrovert, brain racing, attention-seeking, to stop and listen. Thank you for the ping-pong analogy. Maybe that will help me heed the advice I was given.
I can just suck all the air out of the room and take over almost any conversation. It is just part of my makeup. So it has taken me years to become a better listener. And I still have lots of work to do. But I continue to be a work in progress. I try to pay attention to how often I interject my opinion, story, drivel, etc so that I can keep this under control. I learn so much when I do a better job of listening. Thanks for your post.
The fact that you are aware of this, Pat, is 90% of the cure. I know plenty of people who suck all the air out of the room and seem oblivious to the fact that others are gasping for breath!
Well it did take me a few years to figure it out. But you are correct, there are plenty of those folks that have no clue.
Michael, thanks for another very good post. You made me think of my own approach as a consultant who works with CEOs and company leaders regularly. Do I just rant about MY agenda, or do I truly listen to them and engage in a real dialogue? Although I always prepare for a conversation, I aim to remain flexible and attentive to the signs, signals and words that a client or prospective client will give letting me know what their agenda or purpose is and I regularly adjust accordingly. The ping-pong visual is great!
One of the gifts you have (and it is constantly reinforced as I read your blogs) is that of taking a topic and communicating it in a straightforward way with easy to digest parts. Thanks for your commitment to sharing what you have learned and mentoring many.
Wow. Thanks for your kind words. I mainly just preach to myself. If others want to listen in, that's fine, too. ;-)
The "Family Feud Buzzer" is a great metaphor, too. I may have to use that some time. Thanks.
I'm in phone sales. I know when I'm doing most of the talking, I'm losing. It always needs to be a back and forth conversation for there to be a meeting of the mind.
Mike, this is an insightful and important post…for leaders, yes, but also for parents, husbands/wives, friends, pastors…. I especially resonate with number one. I have had those rare, but impactful, conversations with someone who hears even what I don't know how to say. And, I have sometimes had the privilege of being that person who hears the unsaid. It is a very powerful thing.
My persistent struggle is with number 2. Though I have learned to speak with markedly less frequency, I consistently wish I were more succinct…that I could master the "sound bite". Baby steps…
I need to remember these points when interacting with my teenage son. So often I am in transmit mode rather than receive mode.
Excellent post. In my line of work, I tend to have the opposite problem. Oftentimes, I try to engage parent in conversation about their child's academic progress, but I feel like I'm pulling teeth just to get a response. I hate feeling like the one doing all the talking, so when I get into a conversation with a non-responder, I get a very awkward feeling.
I've learned that it's difficult to play ping-pong when the person on the other end of the table has no arms. :) Any advice on this?
Hi, Michael G. (and Michael H., too)–I have found that if I start out a conference with a parent with comments showing him/her that I value his/her child, the parent will be more inclined to participate and talk. Again, taking time to ask questions like what his/her goals are for the student and offering to help in any way possible often leads to a more satisfying discussion. Some parents really don't know how to talk to teachers, so we need to use some of our strategies to engage them (like we engage their children in our classrooms).
Good advice…excuse me…great advice!
Patricia, I agree with you about employing the strategies we use in our classrooms to parents as well. Truth be told, I'm appalled at the inability of so many adults to communicate beyond what they were able to in middle school. I think that, oftentimes, I give too much credit to the ability of people to engage in what I consider basic, everyday dialogue.
Mike,
You'd be surprised what uninterrupted silence and open ended questions can do.
I have learned non-responders do need more prodding (especially in the beginning). Letting them talk, not jumping in (not saying that you are), and step by step relationship building work wonders.
Just my thoughts:)
It's funny that you mentioned uninterrupted silence because I have thought many times about what it would be like to sit there after receiving a one- or two-word answer and just wait. And wait. And wait. Part of me would love to do that, but the other side would probably begin to feel bad for their awkwardness and pick up the slack out of sheer mercy.
I actually have a conference with my "silent-type parents" tomorrow morning. I am going to try to keep the tips I've gleaned from this post and this conversation at the forefront of my mind. I think I'll employ the sustained silence technique. I'll let you know how it goes.
Wow…didn't know I was logging in as my wife! :)
Please do. I am curious.
You're absolutely right: the people who tend to talk the least in conversations with me tend to have the most influence over me. I'm confident that when they do talk, they're aware of my point of view and are going to say something that's both relevant and in my best interest.
This is critical in relationships. I know I can tend to talk too much, and that it belies my genuine heart for the other person.
Your story made me think of something that happened to me at a bridal show. I stopped to speak to a photographer, and I mentioned where my wedding was going to be. That was the one and only detail she ever learned about my wedding, because for the next ten minutes, she went on about all the great ideas I could implement – photography, decor, favors, bridesmaid's dresses….. I could barely get a word in. I have no idea if her suggestions (or her photos) were any good, because the whole time I was thinking to myself, "This woman doesn't know anything about me or my wedding. Why is she still talking?? When can I escape?"
She should have known that every bride-to-be wants to talk about her own wedding. If you want to endear yourself to her, get really, really excited about HER ideas!
Needless to say, I couldn't wait to move on to the next vendor. The photographer we ended up choosing was soft-spoken, respectful of our ideas, and absolutely BRILLIANT.
Listening indeed is the most effective skill of a leader- I re-learned that in George Barna's Master Leaders book. I have learned that people truly respect me because they know I care about them as a person. They are more apt to ask me for advice again.
I too, have run into so many people that talk, talk, talk. And it's a habit that has to be broken. My mom listens extremely well and only talks when it's effective. I can't tell you how many people have called her the model for the Proverbs 31 woman- just because she is silent most of the time!
Thanks for the post.
I learned a while back the value of listening…the only problem was: people would overdue it!!! Once they realized they had an ear they'd go on and on and on and on and on…and on! After a while they'd seek me out to "finish up."
It got really annoying, to be honest!
SO I have learned to interject and "hit the ball back" as you stated. It's helped a lot. If I didn't… I planned to start charging!!!! :)
good points Mike. Sometimes I need to remind myself to follow them more. I'm in a field where people are very vulnerable when they come to see me (Bankrutpcy & Insolvency) I've really had to learn to let the client lead while gently correcting the course of the conversation to get the information I need to help them. Makes for some interesting ping pong at times. Nice image for a convo, thanks
I try to find out as much as I can when I talk to other people. Asking questions shows that I care about them, and often their answers give me insight on how to deal with them. Every person has a story to tell and I love hearing those stories.
Michael, I'm glad you included the importance of body language. Here's an application of that concept in regards to the Bible. When we read the scriptures, what kind of body language do we envision God having? Much of the Bible (like most other literature) can be read in a variety of ways, so how do we know we're understanding just what God wants us to understand? Perhaps imagining His body language could help us. God is love and I Corinthians 13 tells us exactly what love is. When the Bible could be read in a variety of ways, maybe we should close our eyes and see the body language of the One whose love is absolute. Perhaps that would help us see the reality that God is. I know this is kind of weird, but think about it.
About the conference I mean…not about you logging in as your wife ;)
All of these are so hard when you have a personality like mine. I get excited and want to jump in with my opinion/response/thoughts… listening and actually hitting the ball back over the net are the two hardest for me.
I try to keep a drink handy when I'm having a conversation. This has helped me learn to take some drinks and give the other person an opportunity to add their input. I've relied on it less and less as I grow.
Thanks for your insight, as always!
What a helpful list for application. As a counselor I find myself going in deep, even in the mundane. Making one's self vulnerable throughout communication is always a risk. Listening and responding, listening and responding; a kind of caring dance with words.
Taking the art of conversation into deeper waters: Transparency and vulnerability by one often provides a shiney reflective serface from which another may peer inside the depths of their own ideas or personal conflict. However, be forwarned that not everyone appreciates or is prepared for such an opportunity and judgement, and even personal attacks may follow. Hold on then to your progress and trust that this is the beginning of theirs.
Thank you for the very helpful list… a great tool for social skills training!
once again brilliant! and oddly enough even though i've learned these skills through being a vocational leader one of the places they've made the most impact is in how i converse with my kids. i have two phenominal teenagers with a relationship to match largely because i use the guidelines you've stated in this piece. thank you for sharing your insights!